CNN "The Lead With Jake Tapper" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Tulsi Gabbard

Interview

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TAPPER: Sticking with our world lead, WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange arrested in London on charges of conspiracy to hack U.S. government computers which contain classified information. A U.S. official tells CNN more charges could be forthcoming as the Justice Department awaits extradition of Assange.

Joining me now to talk about this and more, Democratic presidential candidate, Congresswoman Tulsi Gabbard of Hawaii.

Congresswoman, aloha. Thanks for joining us.

REP. TULSI GABBARD (D-HI), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Aloha, Jake. Good to see you.

TAPPER: So, you served two tours of duty in the Middle East. You're currently a major in the Army National Guard. Assange, along with Chelsea Manning, spread classified information that prosecutors at Manning's trial claimed could have brought harm to U.S. service members in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Do you agree with that? And what do you think about Assange's extradition and prosecution in the U.S.?

GABBARD: Look, over time there hasn't been any proof that that has been brought to bore (ph) and what we have seen is that so much of the information that's been released has informed the American people about actions that were taking place that they should be aware of. It provided transparency around issues both related to civil liberties, as well actions that our military was taking in the Middle East that they should not have been.

So, really, I think what's happening here is unfortunately, it is some form of retaliation coming from the government saying, hey, this is what happens when you release information that we don't want you to release. And I think that's why this is such a dangerous and slippery slope not only for journalists, not only for those in the media but also for every American that our government can and has the power to kind of lay down the hammer to say be careful, be quiet and fall in line. Otherwise, we have the means to be able to come after you.

TAPPER: So you don't think that he should have been extradited, and you don't support his prosecution in the U.S.?

GABBARD: I think the charges about hacking, those can and should be worked out in the court of law. My point is that I think there's a bigger issue at play here. There's a reason why the Obama administration chose not to extradite and prosecute Assange because they understood the danger. They understood the danger of the government coming in and controlling essentially what information is and is not being released.

We can go back to the release of the Pentagon Papers as an example. We can look to how the American people have benefited from some of this information being released. So I think we've got to look at it within this -- within this larger context here and make sure that we understand what's at stake and actually the danger of what happens when we have people in government, whether it's this administration or a future administration basically saying, hey, look, we can -- we can call you. We can call WikiLeaks a foreign intelligence agency. We can designate them as a foreign asset or this or that, simply because they don't like the information that's being published or they don't like the things that you are saying.

TAPPER: As you noted, he's not being charged with publishing information the government didn't like or classified information. He's being charged with an attempted hack on the U.S. government. But I want to ask about something you said in your first answer which

was that you thought there was transparency in the documents provided by Chelsea Manning and published by WikiLeaks and Julian Assange that you thought was healthy.

[16:20:02] Can you be more specific? What's something you think the WikiLeaks documents revealed that you think was helpful?

Obviously, in 2016, you notably resigned from the DNC. You were vice chair when there were documents that were released suggesting that there were very hostile forces against Bernie Sanders within the DNC. Is that what you're talking about or talking about something relating to Iraq and Afghanistan or both?

GABBARD: And I'm actually talking -- I'm actually talking about some of the things released regarding the NSA and overreach into our privacy, our Fourth Amendment rights being violated because of some of the practices of the NSA and gathering sweeping data on everyday -- on all of us, on Americans across this country, whether it's, about you know, the phone calls that we make or other things.

These are things that even I as a member of Congress were not aware was happening until this information was released. And as a result of that, I and others in Congress have been able to take action to protect our privacy. To protect our civil liberties and try to shut down these avenues that some of our intelligence agencies have abused and violated our constitutional Fourth Amendment rights.

TAPPER: So, the Edward Snowden documents is more what you're referring to, I think, yes?

GABBARD: Right. I mean, exactly. But this is the overarching issue that I'm talking about.

TAPPER: Let me ask you because you're running for president, you just recently tweeted that 65,000 individuals have now donated to your campaign. That would mean you'd likely qualify for the Democratic debates. How much money did you raise in the first quarter, if you don't mind my asking?

GABBARD: We'll be releasing those numbers soon. We're gathering all of our information.

I just want to say I'm really grateful for all the support we've got from folks in every state across the country who recognize the importance of having our voice on that debate stage, where I'll have the opportunity to bring up some really important issues that are not being focused on enough in my view. The issues of why it's so important to end regime change wars, to work to end this new Cold War and nuclear arms race, take the trillions of dollars that we're spending on these wars and these weapons and invest it into serving the needs, the urgent needs that we, the American people have, here at home.

Things like health care, rebuilding our crumbling infrastructure --

TAPPER: Right.

GABBARD: -- protecting our environment, investing in education. The needs are great. We need to fix our priorities and get them straight.

TAPPER: The latest polls find your level of support is at or below 1 percent. I'm wondering why you think your message is not yet resonating? I recognize it's early. But why --

GABBARD: It is early.

TAPPER: Why do you think you haven't caught on yet?

GABBARD: It's early. It's early. You know, there are different polls that say different things.

What we are focused on, what I'm focused on is bringing this important message to the American people about how this change, making this change in our foreign policy, ending regime change wars and this nuclear arms race and new Cold War is central to every other issue that we care about, every other issue that's being raised.

Unless we deal with this cost of war and investing the peace dividend that would come about by making this policy change, unless we do that, then we will not have the resources that we need to make sure we have health care for all to make sure that we have the funds to invest in our infrastructure and education and affordable housing and so on.

TAPPER: All right. Democratic presidential candidate Tulsi Gabbard, thank you so much. Always good to see you.

GABBARD: Thank you, Jake.

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